Barry 0:00

um, how do we normally say it? Welcome.

Justine 0:02

to Alcohol Freedom Finders with

Barry 0:05

Finders. Oh yeah, that's right. Yeah. That's how we do it, isn't it? Yeah. I haven't done an intro for a while.

Justine 0:10

us We haven't sorry I threw you I threw threw it at you I don't mind doing it if you want me to

Barry 0:15

No, I don't mind. I don't mind. Welcome to Alcohol Freedom Finders with me, Barry Condon and my wonderful co-host Justine. Um, today we are really happy to have with us Ian, uh, Ian from Washington State. Uh, he's a successful author and entrepreneur and the creator of the Make It Great, which we'll be interested to hear about. uh, Ian is proudly sober since 2017. Ian, welcome.

Ian 0:43

Thank you guys so much for having me. I greatly appreciate it.

Justine 0:48

It's so awesome um to have you here and looking forward to hearing your story So why don't we just dive straight into the deep end and tell us what was the sort of point that made you realize that becoming alcohol free was gonna be uh a better way forward for you

Ian 1:05

Well, it was 34 years of drunken debauchery for me. Um, and again, I thought, uh, alcohol was my superpower. Um, in 2016, I was approaching my second failed marriage. Um, kids, um, you know, just getting into college, high school and one, uh, in elementary school and approaching my second. Failed marriage. I was kind of getting nudged to like, Hey, maybe you should slow down. And, uh, nothing was ever my problem. Um, and I got nudged into, uh, and encouraged to go to a rehab, uh, which was pretty intense, uh, what they call aversion therapy, where they actually induce vomiting with alcohol, very intense for 10 days. Um, and on the third day, I don't know what the good lord, something happened to me on the third day of that rehab. Um, I went in there to save my marriage, save my business. Um, for my kids, for my friends, I was going into this rehab for everybody else but me. And on that third day, just hit me and it was like, unless you're right, will ever be right. Um, it's on you. And that was a big, it gives me goosebumps talking about it. Um. really resonated with me that I was trying to do this 'cause I had no accountability for my 34 years of drunken mess. It was everybody, it was your fault. It was kids' fault, my wife's fault, my business partner's fault. It was everybody else's fault except me. Um, that was something that I really had to look in the mirror when I was in rehab of like. It's really on me. Like I do need to get my stuff right for me. 'cause unless I'm right, nothing will be right. So that was just kind of like launch me into this path that I've been on for, you know, almost coming on nine years, eight and a half years being sober. Um, so that was a, rehab was a big shock for me.

Barry 2:56

Wow. Yeah, no, I can, I can imagine that. And it, and it, it's so true. We, we say that often to, um, clients of ours that Yeah, it's, it's, you know, why do you want to change, you know, and, and the sort of readiness for change is a very, very big, uh, thing at the beginning of our programs is, is, you know, do you. You know, do you want it for yourself? Do you, do you, you know, you could be motivated by other people, but you need to want it for yourself and, and it needs to be now that you want it now. And, and, and, you know, it, it, you know, there's lots of ways of, of, of peeling that, you know, uh, am I ready? Um, and you know, you don't need to, to know how, and you don't need to. Um, um. You know, you don't need to believe a whole lot, but, but as long as you sort of, yeah, okay. This is the time and it has to be now, and I'm doing it for myself, you know, among other things. But it seems to be for myself. So, so what was next? So, uh, rehab, how long was rehab?

Ian 3:53

Uh, rehab was 10 days, um, very intense. Um, aversion therapy, it's kinda like, you know, touching the stove. Eventually you're not gonna do that. So it was kind of like, um, they, they have you swish booze around in your mouth. This, you know. Spit it in the Silver Bowl and, uh, they induce vomiting. If you have kids, you know what epicc is it in? If, if kids get poisoned, um, they give you this epicc. So it makes you super nauseous and vomiting. then, you know, you're in this like doctor's office, which is really a full bar. Um, we called 'em the bartenders, but they were nurses. Um, and they would, you know, pour a shot of vodka and switch it around in your mouth and spit it out in the Silver Bowl. And here's a shot of Bailey's and they try to get you to 18 shots. Um, by the third shot you're just. Nothing's, everything's coming out. Um, funny story. Um, I don't have silver bowls in my house to this day. Um, um, 'cause my aversion is still so high. It's uh,

Barry 4:52

Yeah,

Ian 4:52

salad

Barry 4:53

you have to keep it in your mouth for a long time. Is that right?

Ian 4:55

you swish it around in your mouth for a little bit. Uh, but the epix making you super nauseous and, and vomiting,

Barry 5:01

Oh, okay.

Ian 5:02

so you didn't take any, um, and you could barely, you know, for me, the, by the time the sick shot came around, swishing around in my mouth, it was just. It was brutal. And you do five days of that, um, and you're watched with nurses and, um, but it was unbelievably intense and my aversion is so high. Uh, still, almost nine years later, I can go to bars and, and hang out in restaurants and be in these events and, and grab people drinks or whatever. But every blue moon I'll get a, a, you know, if they're pouring a, a, a tequila shot or a Jameson and I get a wolf of that, my mouth will still water. Today my aversion is so high.

Barry 5:40

Hmm.

Ian 5:40

Yeah, it's uh, it was

Justine 5:41

That's insane That's

Ian 5:43

very intense.

Justine 5:44

it's quite different to it it's quite different to the approach that we have in our work Like our biggest uh the thing that we deal with is about having grace for yourself and uh sort of coming out of the cupboard and not having shame So you know you must have felt I can only imagine horrific having to go into rehab having to admit that that's what you were going to have to do So yes I understand that the visceral memory of the swishing and the silver bowl plays a massive part but you also had to come up as you said to thin own self be true the you know the oldest phrase in the book goes back to Greek times what's it called Not uh not the setting or something like that which means to thy known self be true Um how did you deal with the shame and find some grace

Ian 6:41

The, that's a great question. Um. You know, drinking was hard to quit. Um, and I'm not gonna take that from anybody, but the toughest part for me was sitting in my dirty diaper of feelings, emotions, because again, I was, it was everybody else's fault and I was numbing any feeling I could possibly have. And I grew up in a awesome home. My parents were amazing. Um, but everything was always okay. We never discussed feelings. Um, and that was a big thing for me that I didn't realize that, you know, I'm 53 years old now and I'm dealing with like childhood trauma that I was dumbing my entire life. Um, to sit with those feelings and emotions and to be sad and to cry and to laugh and to like feel real emotions was the biggest struggle for me. Um. can say that looking back now, that hey, the quitting drinking was tough, but holy cow, the whole therapy and life coach and all the, all the stuff I'm doing and the, the mindset awareness and my routines, uh, was drastically tough for me to, to deal with. And you know, again, that shame and guilt, I use this phrase a a lot, uh, to remind myself every day is like, you have to forgive your younger self. Believe in your current self and create your future self. That's one of my affirmations I use almost every day to remind myself, um, 'cause I had to, I had a lot of forgiveness that I needed for myself. Um, and I know, uh, I've never been through an AA program. very, very familiar with it and know lots and lots of people that went through that to where there's a lot of, uh, apologies that are going, going out to people. And I get a lot of people ask me, Hey, have you apologized to your kids? Um, and the answer is no. Um, because I set the tone the person and the dad I am today. My kids have witnessed a complete drunken debauchery, baboon making a fool of himself, thinking he's the present dad to nine years of being that most present Dad, I could be. I've lost 85 pounds. I'm the most fit. Most mindful, uh, so I've kind of kids learn by catching what you do than what you teach them to do. So I've just kind of led that example, uh, of like, Hey, I am gonna be a changed man and be a better father and a better man, and a better business owner. So, sitting with my feelings was, you know, I still deal with them today.

Barry 9:17

That's brilliant. That's brilliant. Yeah. That, that's, yeah. That frame of mind, that way of approaching it, um, really powerful. Um, and it makes you realize Yeah. That, you know, I, I kind of, that my lowest point was. Um, seeing the faces of my kids looking so disappointed when I was in a drunken mess. And so I almost did it for them, but I never, I never, I never apologized either. It was just, you know, they were so proud of, of what I'd done and, and they could tell that it, you know, that, that, that I'm doing it, you know, for myself and for them and for, you know, for, for, for them all. And they, you know, you see how they, they learn from it. Um, uh, I think this generation drinks less. Uh, as a rule. Um, then our generation did, um, and particularly my daughter is, is uh, um, is very, uh, you know, she, they, they both drink, but, but, but, um, not every day, not in every situation. Not, you know, not, it's not a default for every time. Uh, my daughter particularly will, you know, the once a month or whatever, there'll be a, a thing where her friends do drink and, you know, and she, she has a much better, um. Approach to it than we ever did. yeah, I'd like to go back to the, that aversion therapy. Um. Just, yeah, it's really struck me. I mean, I can sort of, it's not something I've, I've heard of before. You know, I've, you hear of, of sort of, uh, tales of, of people being forced to Dr to smoke, you know, the whole pack of cigarettes to try and put them off smoking and, and, uh, and it made me think, you know, actually when I first had a, I can, yeah, I can sort of see it, that it's your natural reaction is when you are, when you have your first drink is You don't like it. And, and the first time I got drunk. Was on cider. And after that I never liked cider. I could never really drink it. And at the same second time I got drunk, uh, was on white wine. And uh, I never enjoyed white wine again after that. Um, so I could sort of, I could see, you know, it's just sort of bringing you back to, you know, those sort of scenarios and your natural reaction to alcohol is your body knows. It's poison. Your body knows it's, it's ethanol. It's not meant to be there. And it's only the fact that it rings the, uh, the dopamine bell. Uh, that sort of eventually, if you do it enough times, carefully enough, you know, it'll override it and it'll sort of associate and, and sort of, uh, take away those, those tastes, uh, that, that, that, that, you know, the natural feeling of, of, uh, of distaste that you have, uh, those fir those first few times. Um. So, tell us the, the, um, what was the aftermath then? So you, you come out and you, and you've obviously you've had that very traumatic, uh, was that sort of an immediate thing that you, you, you sort of came out and you were sober and, and couldn't drink anymore because of the aversion and then, uh, were immediately confronted with, with these sort of feelings of, of, of, uh, uh, um, um. But yeah. Your, with, with all those feelings, is that how it, how it went or, or, or was it sort of over time?

Ian 12:27

Uh, well, the, the day I got outta rehab happened to be Halloween and we were going to take our youngest trick or treating, and I got served papers the day, the, you know, two hours after I got home. Um, so that was a big pivotal point of like, man, was that all for Naugh or I got this, you know, I get it. Um, I can be accountable for my actions. I'm gonna manage through this and I'm gonna do it sober. Um. Um, so that was a big pivotal point too, that, that literally the day I got outta rehab, I got served divorce papers for my second failed marriage. Um, and I learned so much about myself that it was like, you know what? I was the problem. Um, I did so much damage that I can accept this and I'm gonna do this for me and prove to myself that I can get through this no matter what happens. Um, so yeah, it was just like the. Different knocks just kept knocking me down. But I was on this journey of, and I just lived and breathed. It's on me, it's on me to make this right. It's on me to, to sit with my feelings. It's on. I had, I went and got a life coach pretty quick. Um, and a therapist, you know, in our generation and our age is like, if you have a therapist, there's like, what's wrong with you? Um, and today I think everybody should have some sort of life coach or, or somebody in their life. That is, uh, somebody that you can be completely honest and real with, that you can laugh with, cry with, and there's nothing left unsaid, um, that is so therapeutic for me today. Um, and it's been a game changer for me without my life. Coach Angie, my closest circle, um, my gal, my kids, and my closest four core. You know, it's that old saying, show me your five friends. I'll show you your future. Of how important that is on your journey of, of sobriety or getting clean or on a health kick or on a mindset journey. Your circle is such the biggest influence on you that most people don't even realize how important that is and how subconsciously they're so influenced by those people that you surround yourself mostly with. Yeah.

Justine 14:33

I, couldn't agree more. two years into Barry and I doing this coaching work together and running group, we realized that actually setting up, not just running a month here every, or running a month, every six months, but setting up our. What we call afterglow community has been, has been absolutely pivotal for us. Um, you know, creating that regular diving in to where you can be completely yourself and utterly talk about the bad bits. Like I don't like talking about the bad bits. I keep them maybe even from myself most of the time. Um, but also. There's this amazing celebration to be had, let's talk about that part too. And my daughter said to me yesterday, um, or two days ago, she'd been away for a weekend and she'd been, um, on holiday with another fam, two families, your boyfriend and their family, that my daughter's 15. And she said, came home and said, mom, that I have never had to hang around, um, adults drunk before. And it's really gross. Like she's hung around teenagers at parties, but she's never seen. Um, you know, she's like, they're just gross and stupid. It's really weird when adults drink. And I just

Barry 15:50

Hmm.

Justine 15:51

sense of That means everything to me. Everything that I've done is worth it. If my teenager goes, has never even seen me in living memory. 'cause she's the young, you know, she's 15, she's not seen it. I'm like, I've won. I've role modeled this transformation to her and she sees it. And so I just wanna now just turn the, turn it around and start talking about your transformation.

Ian 16:20

Y Yeah, it's, uh, it's been one of the, nothing good came out of alcohol for me. Everything has been better. Uh, I bought back so much time. I wasted so many, so much time. It's, it, it's years of my life. Uh, from sitting in a bar from noon to 10 o'clock and people would be think, can you do that? Uh, yeah, I can. And I didn't just do it one day a week. It was four or five times, sometimes six, maybe even seven. 'cause the parties would roll to my house. I could text a group of people and have 26 people at my house in five minutes. And that transformation. Of buying my time back is, is insane the amount of money that I spent, I, I did the math, um, because I, I go wild and crazy. My, my, my, my, one of my biggest last hurrah is I was at my son's 21st birthday. He is at college and I, I take care of the bar tab at $2,300 and that was very common for me to buy a lot of friends in bars. Be like, Hey, Jimmy. Barry, Justine come. Yeah. Have a drink with me. Come on over. And like, I'm, I'm, I, I got 15 friends at the bar and I'm, I'm, I got a, a 800, $900 bar tab. I spent over a million dollars in 34 years of drinking. And I, it's probably north of that. Um, 'cause I was pretty conservative from, from client entertainment to picking up bar tabs just constantly. And again, this just wasn't, oh, a couple times a year. This was. Very common to, for me to spend 3, 4, 5, $6,000 a month on alcohol was insane. And so, buying my time back, the amount of money that I've saved and I've lost 85 pounds, I've never been in better, uh, in better mindset and physical health in, in my entire life, even when I was in high school and college playing sports. Um. Everything has been better. My relationships have been off the charts. Um, my communication has been off the charts. Everything has been better for me being sober, everything.

Barry 18:26

That's really inspiring. Really inspiring. And, and so tell me about the, the, the, the beginning. How about going back your, your sales guy, how did he go back to work and, and, and find and, and take clients out and, and you know, how was that, how did you find your way in that?

Ian 18:40

Yeah, so I, uh, I'm still a big soda water drinker. Um, and vodka sodas used to be my drink of choice. Uh, on the tail end of it, I drank everything. I, I really didn't care. I'd be jamon shots, you know, uh, Guinness, um, whatever. I really didn't care. But if I was gonna have a go-to on my tail, it was vodka soda. So soda water is kind of like, you kind of fit in, I don't know, just with my energy or my vibe and. Just the new mindset I had that it was like I could get jabbed at a little bit. Like, oh, hey, how come you're not drinking anymore? I'd be like, I'm just, you know, um, trying to be healthier and fitter. And so I had that at first, but again, just like you guys, I have set the tone for me that, that ripple. Uh, people looking at me of like, if that guy cannot drink, of like, holy cow, I've seen him on bars. I've seen him get kicked outta places. Um. If that guy can do it, maybe I can. Because look at his relationships with his kids, his job, he can sit in this bar and have just as much fun and watch us drunk idiots, baboons. And our re You know, it's, the funny thing is like your, your daughter at these parties probably listen to the same story six times over and over and over. 'cause drunk people just get on repeat and you're kinda like, oh my God, you've said this a hundred times. Let me get outta here. Uh, which we've been there ourselves so we can relate to it so much. Um, just the silent influence that you have on people for me, um, 'cause I had to, like, I still had to do my dinners and, you know, martini lunches. If somebody wants to have one, be like, no, I have an iced tea. I'm good. Oh, you're not drinking anymore? How come? Uh, I just need a, I need a life reset. And then after, you know, a couple months of those with the same client, uh, they, I think there's so many people out there that are sober curious. Is, I love that word, sober, curious. 'cause they're there, but they're not there. They're looking at you. Uh, they're looking at Justine, they're looking at me. They're looking at other people and be like, man, look at their life now without what is missing? The only thing missing outta their life is this stupid booze in, in wine and in happy hours. Wow. Maybe what if I did right? It's that sober cure. It's like, oh, I'll try it for a week or two or a month, or kudos to you. Um, and there's just, I think there's so many people out in the world that are at that, that point, right? Of like, maybe I should, maybe I should. Um, and hopefully they do something before something catastrophic happens, right? Like, knock on wood, I've made stupid decisions, bad decisions driven when I shouldn't be driven, said rude, disrespectful things to people. Um. I and I have no more, I don't have those regrets in the morning, like this goofy thing in the, in the morning after my drinking days, I'd be like, oh, no. Did I text that to somebody? It'd be like, whew. I don't have any regrets either, which is a, a ginormous thing for me.

Justine 21:33

Great. So you've gone from being this guy that spends all of his money and, uh, spends all of his time in bars. So you've gone from being a guy that, uh, is a big loser, really losing all his money in the bar, and you've become someone that's gaining everything. Well, actually you were losing. Now you've become a different type of loser. You've lost weight. But you are, you're gaining everything else. And, and I think the most important thing that we gain when we, uh, transform our life is our self-respect. And, you know, we start to, um. I'm not saying that things get easier, we really are living in the present moment and living with our feelings that that doesn't change. But, um, you were talking about waking up in the morning and, and seeing those texts and those messages, the receipts of, of the dam of the damage, you know, the financial receipts, the, the text messages, and now you can wake up. Uh, and the biggest thing for us in our work is that you wake up with a sense of renewed hope. Every day is a new day and a day. They have some gratitude. So, um, on that note, we're really excited to hear about your book and how, um, how, how that will land for, for our viewers.

Ian 22:47

Yeah, I, I wrote a book. People were like, "Well, what, what made you write a book?" And it was like, I just wanted to make an impact on somebody. And with all my counseling and therapists, um, and support of my family and my circle is like, hey, you know, I've always wanted to make an impact on people. I never thought I'd be some drunken, all my drunken debauchery stories, but, you know, there's, there's a purpose for everything. Um, so I wrote the book, it started with three of us, uh, a couple guys I work with and then it, it got real, real. It is, I, it's naked truth. It's, there's some funny stories. I had my kids write letters in there that are very tear, tear jerking, emotional. Um, and it's, you could read this book in, in maybe an hour. It's not real chapters. It's kind of story driven, but it relates to somebody, it'll relate to somebody even if they don't have a drinking problem. It could be a relationship problem. It could be, uh, being present for your kids. That word has whole new meaning to me today of being present. Um, and then just, uh, little nuggets of, um, gratitude, my daily affirmations, my, my fitness journey, my mind journey, my, uh, talk about my therapist and counselor in there a lot of, and my circle. I think my next book I write, it'll be like my circle of four or circle of six of like, it, it, it is the most important thing in my life is my circle. And I believe people come into your life for seasons. Um, and I had a lot of great people in my drinking days, uh, but that season's over. Um, so I wrote a book about it just to make an impact, no different than you, you two on, on your podcast, making an awesome impact on people, uh, because it warms your heart to share your story and make an impact on somebody.

Barry 24:29

I love that. That's, that's really cool, really cool. Yeah, I mean, that's something I'd, I'd like to Yeah, I've thought about, you know, right, you know, I think, you know, to be able to tell that story and, and be able to sort of lay it down and, and, and the things that you've learned, um, yeah, I think that's really, you know, we'll put the, uh, a link to that, uh, in, in the, in the show notes. Um, but, um, yeah, we're getting to the sort of the end of, end of our time. So, um, what we normally ask, uh, our guests, uh, to think of are the three words that sort of summarize, you know, what being free of alcohol, uh, uh, uh, means to them. Do you have three words for us?

Ian 25:08

I do, that's a, that's a great question. And for me, uh, it's pretty easy. Um, it, it's on me. It's on me to make a difference. It's on me to make an impact. It's on me to be a better person. It's on me to set the tone for the day. Um, so my three words is it's on me.

Justine 25:28

Oh my God, I love that so much. And it really resonates with me as well. 'cause recently I've been thinking, holy cow, it wasn't about alcohol in the first place. on me to be kind to people. It's on me to be kind to myself. It's on me to not speak ill of myself or anybody else. If, if my life isn't how I want it to be, there's only one person that's gonna change that. Not my husband, my children. No one's gonna step up for me and this I'm stepping up for me. And that is the, the surprise. This is sort of like the surprise at the end of the, this journey is da, it's on you.

Ian 26:08

Yep..

Justine 26:09

you. And I love that so much that you've said that. 'cause I reckon, you know, if people, if we could tell people one thing, it would be that wouldn't it? And you know

Barry 26:18

Hmm.

Justine 26:19

at the end of this, it's not like you are fitter, faster, richer, it's that you get to be you. I love that.

Ian 26:27

Thousand percent.

Justine 26:28

for being with us.

Ian 26:30

I can't thank you guys enough for, for having me, and I can't, you know, keep, keep pushing your message, uh, because even when you feel like it's not being heard, it's being heard.

Barry 26:40

And is there social media where we can find you or, or, or a website?

Ian 26:43

Uh, yeah, you can go anywhere on Instagram, TikTok, Facebook, LinkedIn. Um, you can just look at my name, E&P, or the name of the book is Wild Ride to Sobriety. Um, and you can find the book on Amazon. Uh, what, if

Barry 26:58

we'll put a link in.

Ian 26:58

you guys can see this, that used to be me back in the day.

Justine 27:06

Bring it

Barry 27:06

A

Justine 27:06

Bring it over. I

Barry 27:07

little bit to

Ian 27:08

Which way, that way?

Barry 27:10

other way.

Justine 27:10

other way I.

Barry 27:12

Oh yeah, wow. It's a big unit.

Ian 27:16

was a big fella.

Barry 27:18

Yeah.

Ian 27:18

a lot of Guinness right there in Jameson

Barry 27:20

Yeah, I've got a few of those before and after photos as well. Yeah.

Ian 27:25

Well, thank you guys so much. I super appreciate it. And if there's anything I can ever do for you guys, please feel free to reach out.

Barry 27:32

That's great.

Justine 27:33

So

Barry 27:34

Thanks a lot, Ian.

Ian 27:35

Yeah, thanks for, uh, working with my schedule and, and bouncing around for me. I appreciate it. You guys are doing awesome.