0:01

This is Alcohol Freedom Finders. After a career in advertising for big alcohol, our guest, Adam Murphy, blows the whistle on his former employers, comparing their methods for selling a known cancer causing agent to those of big tobacco. He describes how governments are powerless because they're also invested in the success of our alcohol companies. We sell a product they know kills consumers and we, the consumers are auto enrolled into a drinking culture that often feels inescapable. We'll also hear how Adam escaped his work with big alcohol and found alcohol freedom for himself. But before that, Justine and I catch up on what's been going on in our lives. My alcohol flashback at a network event and Justine's coaching skills making her an expert guest on another podcast. Let's dive in.

Barry Condon: 0:53

to see you. How you doing?

Justine Clark: 0:58

I'm really well today. I'm great.

Barry Condon: 1:01

Excellent. Excellent.

Justine Clark: 1:02

Having already done one podcast for the day.

Barry Condon: 1:06

huh.

Justine Clark: 1:07

How are you?

Barry Condon: 1:09

I'm good. I'm good. Yeah, I had a, sort of funny experience this week. I went to a thing, and got suddenly sort of a bit of a flashback to how things used to be. And how I used to, uh, the need to drink in order to, to get through those kind of occasions. and it made me see things in a very different way. Now you sort of realize, watching other people, how they, also use alcohol to get through that it, yeah, it kind of works against you in a way because, you know, after a while, your initial anxiety and, that you, that we all feel as we, meet new people and, and, and, want to make a good impression, that, that calms down. And you become to be more authentic and be yourself and relax into

Justine Clark: 2:06

exactly.

Barry Condon: 2:07

when you're, when I was drinking in the past, you know, actually sort of telling yourself, you're not able to do that. And, you're kind of, trying to let yourself not care about, your anxiety rather than, than deal with it. interesting. Yeah,

Justine Clark: 2:25

it's kind of what we were talking about the other day, is realising that leaning into yourself is a great reward, being able to overcome the discomfort, and then realise that you can do it, and you can do it better. Today I just did a, I did another podcast, which is amazing, for a functional medicine practitioner who brought me on board as a, as a wellbeing coach. So I was speaking to how without alcohol, in my life, regulating my nervous system is so much easier. That jangled feeling that we get. So, not only am I not drinking alcohol at the event that you're talking about, I don't have that jangled feeling that I, sort of, we could call it anxiety, we could call it nerves, that, that up and down feeling all the time. So, what I was speaking to you about is how, having a coach really helps to work out the things that we need as individuals to calm our nervous system. And whether that's, you know, hands on therapy or meditation or talking therapy, and it was exciting to be the expert. I was like, oh my lord, oh my lord, I'm, I'm now, you know. Alcohol, being free from alcohol has led me to realize that I am an expert, and I do know my stuff, and people want to hear what I have to say,

Barry Condon: 3:47

for

Justine Clark: 3:47

and that's, yeah, that's revelation.

Barry Condon: 3:51

Okay. Welcome everybody, to Alcohol Freedom Finders, with me, Barry Condon and my amazing colleague, Justine Clark. Today, we're really excited because we have, Adam Murphy with us and Adam is a former advertising exec and now an integrated psychotherapist and also a coach in the Alcohol Free so Adam, welcome.

Adam Murphy: 4:18

Thank you.

Barry Condon: 4:18

nice to

Justine Clark: 4:19

Yeah, welcome.

Adam Murphy: 4:20

Yeah. Thank you. Thank you. very much for having me.

Justine Clark: 4:22

I'm really curious, about how you've managed to get to this part of your career that you are now doing this. So, what led you to working in the alcohol free space and working, in the way that you do?

Adam Murphy: 4:35

Uh, well, yeah, it sort of goes, it goes quite a long way back really, but I guess the, the, the, the, The sort of rather than starting at the beginning, sort of at the end, um, I left, uh, I left my advertising career at the beginning of 2023 and towards the very end of it, one of my main clients was, uh, a large alcohol company on the footsie. Um, Diageo, and within my role there, I was actually working on the launch of Guinness Zero. So, I was party to lots of, lots of data and information in and around the alcohol free space. Um, so that was uh, that was kind of one of the, one of the, final elements pushed me into, uh, not only recognizing the size of the market and the opportunity. Uh, but also being exposed to some of the data as well as the motivation to some of these companies. So yeah, that was one of the, you know, we'll probably go back, but, um, but yeah, that was one of the multitude of different factors that ended up pushing me into this Um, and, uh, yeah, I'm just delighted, delighted. I am really, I've, I've, I've spent a life in advertising, which is essentially creating false needs that need to be fulfilled by insert companies product, um, which. which. was fine in terms of my sort of aspirations and what I wanted to do as a, as a young man, but it was, uh, increasingly counter to the, the way that I saw myself and how it sat with my own values as I got older. So yeah, it was an industry that was really, odds with what my beliefs and, uh, yeah, and then I was working in alcohol, tobacco, oil, and farmer at the end. So yeah, sort of, uh, you know, for the, for the kind of worst sectors, really. So yeah, pushed me into exploring something different. Now I'm into alcohol free, which, which means not only, um, helping, helping people on their own alcohol free journeys, but also, you know, large part of it is, is education as well as education as to You know why why this product is out there as it is why it's communicated the way it is You know i've got lots of sort of Kind of I hate the term but poacher turned game keeper kind of insight Which is really useful for

Barry Condon: 6:40

That's a, that's amazing. two questions really. I mean, I I'd be excited to understand more about, the data and the information and the sort of insider, sort of communications, how to, how, how the, alcohol companies look to, alcohol free products now and, and, the way that they, approach marketing in general, that would be interesting, but also, but firstly, you know, how long have you been, alcohol free and, and, and how was that transition for you? How did you find alcohol

Adam Murphy: 7:09

Uh, so I have i'm up to 16 months now Um, so yeah last summer I I stopped and it was a con I'm sure you know, there's there's kind of no one story. Is there lots of people get their different ways, isn't it? and Uh, you know, I I got You know, from a health perspective, I got gout for the first time, which, you know, isn't particularly, it wasn't particularly sexy the way I got it.

7:34

If you're looking to take back control of your drinking, why don't you join our Alcohol Freedom Finders 30 day group program. It's a great place to start. Because we approach it as an experiment, rather than a challenge. Whereas, as well as getting a great detox, you learn the science and the psychology about why you're drunk in the first place. So whether you want to stop altogether, or just become a more mindful and moderate drinker, why don't you give it a crack? Use the link in the show notes to sign up to our next 30 day program, and you won't regret it. Because no one ever woke up in the morning and said, I wish I'd had more to drink last night, did they? Back to the episode.

Adam Murphy: 8:15

You know, my drink of choice used to be real ale, which is very yeast heavy, which, you know, is what drives a lot of that. So my first gout flare up sort of triggered that actually something might not be right here. Um, you know, within my industry, I've mentioned before, you know, I was, I was doing lots of client entertaining, um, very social person, play a lot of sport, you know, captain, run sports clubs, whatever. So, you know, I'd, I'd effectively built a, built a lifestyle around, around alcohol for a very long time. Um, and yeah, it got to the point where I was. I had to recognize it was no longer serving me, ultimately, you know, and, you know, people talk about a rock bottom story and, you know, my mind doesn't really have that. Um, but, you know, there was certainly a period when, you know, my wife was away, I was looking after my children and, you know, essentially not really fulfilling some pretty basic duties, I guess, but, you know, it's just, it was an accumulative effect over, over the years, you know, I'd, I'd been getting sober curious is obviously a phrase that we use a lot. I've been sober curious for six years before I stopped. So that started with, you know, a friend of mine, um, I went on a holiday with him and, you know, we start counting, counting the units. So this is basic as that really. So, so from that moment, I now recognize that as soon as you start doing things like that, you know, the, you know, the pennies kind of beginning to drop, isn't it, and it's just how long you can move. the people you're working with into that, that element of recognizing that you may want to change into actually changing, reducing that time period is, is, is critical. I think, you know, it took me six years. Um, some people depending on where they fall off, get there much quicker, but I think that's a, that's a key part of it. So, um, yeah, so, So, 16, 16 months. um, but yeah, within that, there was periods of sobriety within those six years, uh, areas where I thought, Oh, I've cracked it. Okay. You know, I don't need it anymore because ultimately I hadn't done the work really. I was just, you know, white knuckle in it, uh, which is another commonly used phrase. Um, I hadn't actually made any of the changes in my life, and I hadn't actually changed the relationship with alcohol, which, which is what you have to do in order for it to have a, have a sort of lasting effect.

Justine Clark: 10:28

That's awesome. I mean, that's what we talk about all the time. The difference that the willpower is actually a muscle. So, you know, it's like hanging on to the edge of the cliff. You can

Adam Murphy: 10:36

Yeah,

Justine Clark: 10:36

for a time may not very long, but, you know, over time that that muscle fatigues and

Adam Murphy: 10:41

yeah, absolutely.

Justine Clark: 10:42

bringing the beliefs up underneath that actually creates that transformation. you know, that lasting change doesn't happen. One thing that you just said to me really stood out. And you said to me that alcohol no longer served you. what you know, in terms of marketing in the industry and knowing what we know that society is actually telling us that alcohol serves us. My question to you is, alcohol ever serve you

Adam Murphy: 11:10

Uh, yes, I think it did. You know. And we've got to be very careful of, you know, wanting to erase our, our, our past. Um, yeah, I had many, many great times with alcohol in my teenage years and early twenties, I think. And it gave me many great memories, which I'm, I'm glad I had, you know, yes, I probably took it to excess during those times, but yeah, I think it did it did serve as a, um, as a as a way of, you know, driving an experience and. shared experience at the time. So yeah, I certainly don't regret that those moments, but I think it is also important to say that I can kind of pinpoint the area where it did begin to stop serving me and how long it took for me to actually act on that. Um, you know, I recognize now that I think I had a, I had a go or. You know, it must have been, again, my lifestyle was, you know, I would be doing lots of client entertaining. So it'd be days after days after days. I was in my early thirties, so sort of 15 years ago, I sort of had a, had a good sort of, sort of crack at doing it for a couple of weeks and recognizing it wasn't serving me, but ultimately, you know, the ego was too big for it to stick. Um, and you know, and now I'm on the other side of it, recognizing the, the egoic behavior is a key part of, um, moving into a lifestyle that is sustainable without alcohol. So, so yes, I do believe, I do believe it was serving me at the beginning, but certainly, you know, certainly not towards the end and certainly not for many years towards the end. And, you know, I think that's for people who are considering giving up. I think it's trying to help people recognize when that point is.

Justine Clark: 12:50

Yeah.

Barry Condon: 12:51

Yeah, I think you're right. I mean, there is, there is, there's diminishing returns. and I don't know whether that's age or, or, or just we become, more and more immune to, The sort of, euphoric effects that, that it, that it has in the early days. I certainly see it in, in myself looking back and I see it in friends still that drink a lot, that they just seem to get less and less out of it. And it, it's,, you know, it's very difficult to watch. Sometimes the people that seem to drink an awful lot, don't seem to change a great deal. but they seem to need it. And, and he just, Oh, it would be so nice if you could understand that, that it's holding you back and you'll feel so much better if, if, if you just let it go. you know, everybody has to find their own path and everybody, you know, needs to do it in their own way and, and in their own, at their own pace. but yeah, so tell us, tell us, tell us some gory details about, about, advertising and how the, the, the those, dodgy people, at, Diageo, uh, uh, try and trick us

Adam Murphy: 13:53

Well, it's obviously the fault of the consumer, isn't it? You should be drinking responsibly.

Barry Condon: 13:58

Oh, of course.

Adam Murphy: 13:59

Um, yeah, I mean, it's a, it's a very, uh, it's a very tricky space, isn't it? You know, it's, you know, they're, they're obviously aware that what they're selling is, is a poisonous substance to public health, um, and doing everything they can to not recognize that in the public. space is essential really, which is why you're pushing the owners onto the consumer, um, which is why you never see anybody suffering from the effects of consuming their products. Um, and you know, it's, uh, it's the, the, the, the relationship with alcohol, and society is uh, is a is a very complex one. Uh, and you know, I think it's very important to understand not only the, the, uh, the, the. large companies promoting alcohol, but also where, where these large companies sit. within, you know, public policy within, our own government, not just our government, other governments around the world. Um, you know, these, these is a, it's a sizable, um, sizable company on the footsie. Uh, it would make up, uh, a significant, you know, a significant proportion of its shares would be held by, um, pension companies, which means that, you know, the government is. is invested in the success of these alcohol companies. So, you know, that, that's just a sort of very crude top line. Sort of, sort of, um, look into exactly how intertwined some of these some of these things are, um, and for that reason, you've just got to be, as a consumer, you need to be highly, you need to be highly, um, aware of the motivations of any company, you know, um, especially ones that are in this sort of space, you know, they're, they're, they're, their only motivation is to, you know, They'll call it deliver value to shareholders, which ultimately means to drive profit and they'll do it by any means possible. Uh, you know, we is alcohol is a, is a regulated market in terms of, how it's produced and, who it's sold to. Uh, but I think, you know, pretty much everyone who's listened to this was probably drinking or had experienced drinking below the age of 18. And. There's all manner of methods and techniques used to make the, make the product more attractive, you know, so, you know, I've, I've obviously been involved in lots of, you know, when you're producing casting, you know, you don't obviously cast ugly people, you don't cast people who aren't having a good time, you don't cast people who are sat in, um, sat in their pants watching the same fishing video for the fourth time on, a, on, on a night. You know, um, and it's, it's uh, it's, you know, it's seen as a highly aspirational lifestyle and that's what people buy into. And it's, in terms of the marketing, marketing dollars that are spent, you know, you know, we just think of the TV ads, the, the, uh, outdoor and maybe bits that we've seen in newspapers, but it goes, it goes much deeper than that. You know, the, how the, how the lie is pushed into all areas of culture. And, and now, you know, working in the sector that I do. You just see it on, in all sorts of like the movies and whatever, you know, my, my, I've got a daughter who's, who's 10, who we let, we let her watch 12s, you know, so I guess we shouldn't do that, but we let her watch 12s, but even, even at that sort of, um, rating. The amount of times there's reference to doing shots, people in parties, you know, and alcohol being seen as the elixir to life and good times. And it's, uh, it makes it really, really tricky when you've, Like ourselves, when we've been born into countries in a culture where we've in effect been auto enrolled into a culture of drinking to, to then start to look beyond that is very, very complex, especially when you've got all of these cultural cues through advertising, just being thrown at you constantly. Um, it's, uh, you know, you're, you're seen as odd if you don't, if you don't partake, you know, and I think that's one of the, that's one of the big things. Yeah. in and around the, uh, the clients I work with is just sort of recognizing that, you know, you are leaving the tribe to a certain degree. And, you know, that, that is absolutely to be applauded because the easiest thing is just to stay in it. And in fact, I'm sure lots of people, lots of the people you work with have stayed in it for far too long for fear of rejection of the tribe. And this is, uh, this is just a self fulfilling prophecy, which is spun out by the, by the advertising companies to keep you involved. So, you know, It's uh, It's a really complicated business. They're selling the product that they know kills consumers. You know, I'm assuming you use these stats as well. You know, it's class one carcinogen, which puts it alongside asbestos, radiation, and tobacco. That means it's, uh, it's known to induce cancer. It has cancer causing properties confirmed, you know, and what we're doing is we're selling versions of it, albeit diluted quantities to, to a Which is just completely ludicrous, you know, completely ludicrous. And, you know, I think we can, we can all recognize that the world is going to be a very different place in 50 years time and, um, it's, you know, we are where we are at the moment, but it's important that we educate ourself in, in, in, and around that. And, and just whilst talking about some of the, the comms techniques that advertising companies use it, you know, one of the, in the same way, there's, there's parallels with, unfortunately I also worked in tobacco. And there are parallels in terms of the tobacco industry as well. So, you know, tobacco if you think of tobacco use through the 50s, 60s, 70s. Um, you know, it was actually, it was sold as a way of, um, soothing throats in the, in the fifties. Um, and, you know, obviously, known, known, uh, health issues, and they pushed, pushed health warnings onto cigarette packs, which, which we got. We then got the no smoking in pubs. And. Quite clearly, there's a push to do that within alcohol as well. So I was, you know, I was working alongside, uh, the department in the business who were charged with, um, lobbying, uh, European governments around packaging and, and that means to keep off the warning signs on the bottles, you know, alcohol kills you. You know, there's all manner of stats you can put up there, you know, in 20 years time, they'll probably have a picture of a bloated liver on there or something anyway. Um, There is a requirement to, or the lobbying that happens within, you know, and it's not just the company that I was working for, it's every large alcohol company, all lobbying the governments to ensure that the health ministers don't push through these warnings on the bottles. So then, you know, you've got to understand who's making this decision, like these decisions aren't being made in the best interest of the public. Uh, because as soon as that warning goes on, the profits are only gonna go one way in these alcohol companies as, as they did in tobacco companies. you know, you know, the, the, uh, the drinking base is reducing year on year. I saw wine was down 3%, uh, on 2 0 2 0 2 to 2 0 3, which I thought was quite interesting. We know that the younger consumers aren't just, aren't consuming alcohol in the same way. Uh, as soon as these warning. Labels hit the bottles. Then it's obviously going to massively impact, impact their business. Interestingly in Europe, the only country that managed to push it through Ireland and Ireland were also the um, the innovator with smoking as well. They were the first ones to put the warnings on the packs and also to, to ban smoking in pubs. So yeah, they're going to be warnings on the bottles in Ireland coming in the next couple of years. And everyone in Europe will be sat on their hands just to see how that goes. Basically. But in the meantime, you know. Lots of governments will be taking the money offered by various large alcohol companies in order to, you know, I guess they'll call it fund pet projects of ministers or, you know, an investment in the health department. Whatever way you want to describe it, you know, I'll be careful the terms I use, but it's corporate lobbying, which is to effectively suppress the truth of the impact of the product.

Justine Clark: 22:00

Yes, that makes perfect sense. And if a consumer wants to sort of, or one of our potential clients wants to find, find the real stats and the real facts, if you've got source information or a place where people can go and have a look at that for themselves, that you can give to us.

Adam Murphy: 22:19

Uh, yeah, I've, I've got, I've got, um, some, yeah, a sort of facts pack that I use. I mean, yeah, you, you, it's always good to use the WHO, World Health Organization. They're the, they're the sort of the best ones to sort of refer to with regards to, to health, I think. Um, and in the same way that, you know, we, we ride, ride roughshod over some of the positive claims that are made by, by alcohol companies, you know, there's also, you know, lots of. people who, you know, are against alcohol, who, who, you know, some of them do have dubious stats as well. So yeah, World Health. organization is, uh, is always the go to, I think, with any of this.

Justine Clark: 22:59

Good. And also, Given that you've stated clearly that big business is involved, government is involved, and I love the fact that you called it auto enrollment. So society auto enrolls us into drinking. where do you see us making the most significant headway and change helping to affect, you know, the, the turning of the tide?

Adam Murphy: 23:21

Uh, very good question. Uh, I think, I, I think that, that comes, and it, it, it is a movement, you know, and I think, I think it comes from an individual basis, you know. It happens with, you know, by you not drinking, you're, you're having a significant impact on four other people around you. You know, and, and actions as always speak louder than words, uh, in, in the same way that, you know, we were swept up with, you know, maybe our parents drinking or friends drinking, you know, the same thing happens the other way, you know, and it's, uh, you know, I'm not one that's going to be going and banging drum down to, uh, down in the street or anything like that because it's a superfluous action, you know, but what I will be doing is through my immediate action. actions, I will be seen as a, I will be recognized as being that person in and amongst my, my family and friends. And for me, that is very important. And I have no doubt. Although they probably wouldn't say, within 10 years that will be recognised as a reason why they've stopped drinking.

Justine Clark: 24:23

Love it.

Barry Condon: 24:24

really good. Yeah, I think, I think you're right. I think, yeah, the more we can normalize it, the more we can make it. It's something that people can talk about and, and just see. Through us, you know, that we're actually, you know, we feel better off. We look better. We're happier and more energetic and, and yeah, all the benefits that people can, can just see. so hear a little bit about, uh, about who you're helping, how you're helping them and, and what on earth is integrated psychotherapy. That's

Adam Murphy: 24:54

my target audience that I work with, so, um, I work within a, um, another programme as well, a, chap called Will Armstrong, um, and also James Malone, called the Teetotal Trail. Uh, and, uh, You know, my target audience is very much people who have been drinking for over 20 years and alcohol is no longer serving them. So there's, you know, I'm aware that's quite a large sort of definition. Um, it's very important to people that I work with that they've gone through at least a couple of years of of sober curiosity, you know, does it suit them taking short breaks, things like that. And the reason for that is just to, just to ensure maximum effect, um, with the people that I'm working with, within the T Total trail. Uh, we also work with a lot of people who have substance abuse as well. Cocaine is, is rife in not only our country, but across the Western world. Um, it's, uh, it's a very taboo subject. Lots of people always like to talk about how its usage is increasing, but they don't know anyone who does it. And it certainly doesn't happen in their company. Um, however, that is, that is obviously not the case. And, uh, you know, we work with a very, very wide range of people, everyone who works within a particular sector thinks their sector must be the worst, but, you know, as we found out now that all sectors are. So it's in all sectors and it's across society and, you know, the, uh, you know, lots of the usage, lots of cocaine usage is to extend drinking. capacity and drink in time. Uh, you know, not, there's not many people that I work with who are, who are, who are solely, solely there for, for cocaine usage. So, you know, alcohol really is the gateway drug to all of this, which is, which just makes the fact that, you know, we sell it in big crates at the front of the supermarket before you even get to the fruit and veg, and you can buy it in petrol stations now. The fact that it's the gateway drug to many bad decisions is just ludicrous. Um, but you know, it's, it's commercial success is, is obviously very important for the country. So that's why it's pushed the way the way it is, but so so yeah, I generally work with people in their thirties, forties, fifties, looking to remove alcohol from their lives and, um, yeah, it has uh, yeah, it has really good traction. I work in three and six month programs and, uh, it's, it's essentially. about walking through key milestones with regards to undressing the glamour of advertising to start making sure you, you, you understand, um, where it sits in, in society and therefore your life. I do a lot of work from a psychological perspective, um, because self identity is critical within this process because many of us have grown up with alcohol. So, you know, if I think about my own self identity, um, my own self identity had a lot of alcohol in it, as I mentioned, you know, and it's almost embarrassing to admit it was a, it was a large part of my personality, which, which I'm highly embarrassed to say now. Um, but we need to move through that self identity of the individual. So I do a lot of psychological work and then it's into repetitions and implementations of the skillsets learned. Um, yeah, so that's how the, that's how the program works.

Justine Clark: 27:48

That's brilliant. so just, as a practical session, what would a client have if they, with you, if they come to see you, what would happen?

Adam Murphy: 27:58

Uh, it's it's not, it's not a short session. So, um, I, I, I work on, as a top line, we work on identifying what are any unhealthy, negative beliefs that are underpinning any behavior. Um, that can take, that can take a while to come through. Um, and from that, you're able to then, you know, devise a sort of personalized program to help them understand why. why they drink or use the way they do And and then move beyond that. And lots of that is underpinned by, you know, really good practice in exercise, nutrition, um, sleeping. Meditation is a large part of what I do. Hypnotherapy is a large part of what I do. Hypnotherapy, for those who don't know, is kind of like a clinical meditation. Um, meditation is, meditation is, a really big part of what I do. Um, and lots of people, you know, as you can imagine the type of people that, present with challenges with alcohol or substances. Lots of people like to say, I've got ADHD or, you know, my mind goes a million miles an hour. Um, which is, which is obviously true, you know, and it's recognizing that any sort of desires that arise in agitation are aligned with the ego. yet, you know, the desires that arise in stillness are those which are more aligned to what you, your soul really, what sits in your subconscious. And that's why meditation is so important because it provides that stillness. And lots of the answers come out, um, when we, when we align ourselves with what is in our subconscious. So that is why meditation hypnotherapy is a, is a key part of moving along or changing that self identity, which is really important in making an alcohol free lifestyle stick.

Barry Condon: 29:39

really interesting. I mean, I know that, that, that we focus a lot on the subconscious as well. And that, that kind of, the, the cognitive dissonance that exists between our sort of executive, higher brain, that understands, you know, that. That things aren't serving you anymore and that we're making bad decisions and yet that the subconscious keeps telling us, Oh, go on, you know, you'll feel better if you do. And, and, and, and that, you know, just sort of trying to understand and listen and stop the, stop the struggle. is definitely, and I can, I can imagine, you know, that, that, that meditation and hypnosis can, could certainly, people to, to access. a pathway through all that. why don't we, ask the, the, the question that we ask all our guests, to wrap this up. what are the three, key words to you that, that sort of summarize how you and why you found, uh, alcohol

Adam Murphy: 30:33

Uh, so it, Yeah, you shared that this before. So I did, I did make a little note. So the first one was courage, um, which is really important, I think, uh, because, you know, lots of us are wrapped in very egoic behavior to start with. And, you know, before, before stopping, we've usually tried to do a number of things within the world of moderation before we stop trying to control it in certain ways. So, you know, having that courage to really make the decision of, you know, I'm not moderating. It's no longer serving me. I've got to do something about it. And that, that first step is, is huge, you know, and you're in you're in a sort of bit of a whirlwind for the first couple of weeks when you, when you try and get to come to terms with the size of the decision that you've made. Um, as well as it being a very exciting period, it's like you're obviously stepping into the unknown, which is um, which is a bit wild. So yeah, courage is the first one. Presence is the next one. So just being So much more present in every area of my life, um, you know, my my relationships, my work, um, again, I just, you know, we would have our past as our reference point, but yeah, I just recognize how, how, you know, my egoic behavior just meant that I wasn't present. for a large part of it, albeit in the room, not there mentally. Um, and longevity, longevity is a, is a really important part of this. You know, again, it's a bit of a bit of a sort of overused phrase, you know, not just years to your life, but life to years, you know, I'm, I'm 46 now. And if I just think of the, the natural arc of life, I was stuck doing a job, which I really detested. In an industry, which I really detested and my arc, I kind of just played out what my future looked like. I'm very lucky to be married with two daughters and I just sort of played out the arc of my life and you know, I'll carry on doing something which I really hate and then eventually I'll stop doing it and you know, alcohol was going to accompany me, accompany me all the way there and I kind of just accepted that, but getting rid of that now. Like so many things have changed in my life and I'm just, I'm, I'm very, very grateful for it. You know, so, so longevity, you know, we, we know it has a massive health impact. I mean, you know, that can stop just for two or three weeks, but, you know, get, getting as far in as as, as, I am, you guys you know, I know you guys much further, um, you can just see the impact that it has on longevity.

Justine Clark: 32:47

That's brilliant. So how could people find you to help on their journey?

Adam Murphy: 32:54

Uh, so my, I, I do a lot of um, a lot of my DMs and through Instagram. present life is my handle. So present P R E Z E N T life. Uh, you'll be able to see lots of my content up there. So DM, DM me through there and we can, we can jump on it.

Justine Clark: 33:08

Amazing.

Barry Condon: 33:08

Adam, thanks a lot. It's been a real pleasure.

Adam Murphy: 33:12

Thank you for your time. Thanks for having me on.

Justine Clark: 33:13

much for joining us.